Here it is again with the term [This post has been edited by moderators because it does not comply with our terms and conditions. You can find our terms and conditions here: http://www.parkinsons.org.uk/forum_policy.aspx
] removed. you have my details, I will be happy to pist them I stand by every word and welcome any legal challange.
Hi All, GlenChass,
This is the third time I have tried to put in a reply but when finished it timed out. So cunningly doing it on word first.
I suggest a cup of tea at hand this might go on a bit.
So, things are still very tough, the police have still not charged the [edited] that stole my money even though the evidence is overwhelming, [edited] A quick summary, my [edited]accountants over a two year period where taking money from us via a client account to manage my tax/Vat affairs, in all they took £243,000 and when I add the additional cost it comes in at a wonderful £340,000 plus.
So lesson one;
The victims are treated by HMRC, the Police more indifferently, negatively than the Criminals, it appears crime pays and I fully in due time intend to take benefit of that simple true fact. The police it would appear are ineffective, liars in regard to deadlines and I feel confident are incapable of solving any crime that does not include evidence from a speed camera. I concluded that the only real policing are carried out by actors such as Morse etc. I requested a meeting with the Thames Valley Chief of police to be she does not meet the public. I laughed for several minutes when told that and I ask if it was a joke! Sadly it was not. Of course I can complain to the official Police Complaints board who are the very same people dealing with solving the crimes in the first place. I will of course complain but expect little or no assistance. The criminals have had nearly six months to get rid of evidence, hide assets which is incredible as one of them went to the police to hand themselves in.
HMRC do not give a **** that they over a two year period, 5 conference calls (HMRC, Accountants, Me) failed to work out that not a penny had been paid, had failed to investigate the claims by the accountant that they had paid in to a given HMRC account and the figures. HMRC where totally taken in by them. Please note HMRC asked us to do it this way. HMRC even at the final stages stated to me that I should not worry they will find the payments and even though I raised the concern on the calls was it being stolen they assured me it was highly unlikely and to relax. When the accountant handed them self in to the police and HMRC they then came at great speed to me saying the rules are simple, even though you are the victims of a criminal act as officers of the Company you are liable, they gave me seven days to give them £126,000 which included £20,000 of late payment charges. Could you make this up?
The VAT man and his enforcers, well now to keep this comedy going I got a timely letter from HMRC informing me of the following,
1. You have seven days as of the date on this letter above (includes sat/sun as days) to pay £126,000.
2. If I fail to pay they will attend my premises and sequester my goods.
3. We will sell your goods at a fraction of their value.
4. As an officer of the Company they will hold me liable too.
Seven days is not a lot of time to do anything and who is going to lend me money in today’s problems to cover a debt. I had already sold my house and the profit from that was being put in to the business because borrowing was impossible. Now I have a good business, I should have had all HMRC vat/tax covered with over £100,000 profit (p.s. I still have to pay corporation tax on the profit even though it has been stolen) but as you know the thieving bastards got that.
Seven Days now let me clarify how much of the seven days where available to take action. HMRC send mail by 2nd class post, they sent it on the Monday day 1, day 2 in postal system, day 3 in postal system, day 4 Thursday I get it delivered, note not registered delivery just 2nd class post. If I had not received it for whatever reason they would have been there Monday morning. So in my hands Thursday, I call HMRC, for the first time ever I get a human being on the phone. I discuss it with her, explain all the background, she agrees and sees all the notes and accepts we are the victims of a serious crime but admits she is powerless and nothing can be done. I clarify the timelines and ask do they real mean 7 days from when it was generated and really on a second class latter? I felt sorry for this lovely lady because she was as upset as I was and frustrated by how this was being done. They have to send all letters by 2nd class post. So I have until the Monday to pay them in full.
I could feel the room spinning and went light headed, It felt like I was in a crazy trap with no exit, I immediately felt my face go white, a cold sweat start and I felt no matter how much I sucked I could not get a breath of air. I was in a full blown panic attack, my brother who was nearby thought I was having a heart attack, so did I because the pain in my chest and arms was worse than my previous real heart attack. An ambulance was called and I was rushed to hospital. My dear darling wife rushed from her office just in time to be in the Ambulance with me. (The NHS has been a star in all my illnesses and I am so grateful to them, wonderful people) I asked for the priest to attend, told my better half that she must go on and that I was so sorry for getting us in to this mess. At hospital they rushed me in, took blood, put me on a heart monitor, injection in to my stomach. They were concerned at my trace but could not be sure it was because my heart was at fault or a result of my bypass operation 2 years previously. (Hence why two years ago I had to trust somebody to manage my affairs, add a beating from being attacked and then Parkinson’s I was kind of in a hell of a spot) After about two hours they found my trace and assured me it looked fine and was the same as post op trace. I still had to wait till 12 hours past to get results to indicate if a heart attack to place. They wanted me to stay overnight but when I got the result around midnight that I had not had a heart attack I asked my brother to come and get me and take me home, I had two real days left to try and sort this out.
Do not waste your time trying to explain to the VAT enforcer that you’re not well, that you’re the victim, plead for time, point to your already raised formal complaint to HMRC, tell them you have written to the Prime Minister, two MP’s, the Permanent Secretary for TAX, they are not interested. Don’t try to explain why this is crazy to put 17 people out of work; it would cost the Country more.
My Bank Manager has been a diamond personally but the Bank is not to place to go for help. As soon as I informed them of the issues they closed down all of our facilities, quicker than you can say “please help”. The Bank quickly move in to self-protection mode. My accountants where the next stop and after a review they felt I should voluntarily (New accountants had so far charged £5,000 for the work they had done but would not share it until I put the fee in to their account.) put my Company in to liquidation and if I did it voluntarily it would be better for me and get HMRC involved, and as luck would have it they knew the perfectly friendly and officially registered receiver.
Just because your world has fallen apart it does not mean money cannot be made by others during that fall. A form had to be submitted to Court on Monday sign and witnessed and a fee of £1,370 paid up front this would give me two weeks grace to look up my warehouse, get HMRC in line like everybody else. I asked the liquidator what he would take out of this and he replied “not sure it depends on the complexity” my research in to the cost resulted in very little understanding; it appears to be based on a percentage of value combined with fixed fees. We have a considerable amount of assets and our debt excluding HMRC was very small less than £10,000 owed to suppliers, with about £70,000 owed to us. A friend who went bust saw £23,000 going to the liquidator; his turnover was less than mine.
Just because they sympathise don’t mean they care or misguide you. The big meeting on the Monday took place which by the end of we would be locking the door and the wonderfully present double glazing door to door salesperson present AKA the liquidator went on to explain the best thing to do and how to do it. Without knowing f all about my business, how long we had traded, it was suggested that we quickly set up a new Company and sell my considerable assets to it which would avoid paying HMRC. I sat and listened to this person getting a little angrier every minute, this dude not only get paid from the old Company but also from the new Company. By the way HMRC can sell my asset for 1 peanut, but I can only buy them at a fair market rate, they invite my competitors to make bids and as long as mine if fair I should win. Two years no salary, all profit back in the business meant nothing, I have to buy it back, nudge, nudge, wink, wink, like he is doing me a favour, so say maybe £50,000. Of course once we sign the second bit of paper he would be the official liquidator and could not have these types of conversations, oh and he might be able to keep me on as an employee wink, wink. Forgive me my use of bad language but my thought where you’re a slimy bastard that is as ethical as the crooks who stole from me in the first place.
During the meeting 3 things happened. Just went I felt all was lost there was a knock on the meeting room door, one of my staff needed to speak to one of my employees in the meeting with me. I told him to go take the call and he returned shortly with a bit of good news, a prospect came in and would mean some additional revenue from a new Customer, which was nice but would be too late to sort out HMRC. Around 10 minutes later my mobile went off and I knew by the number it was the police so I took the call. I was inform by the end of that week several arrested would be made. I wondered if that was due to the letter I sent to the prime Minister where I moaned about the police. This meant that a wider net of people involved would help with getting our money back and address through public indemnity insurance. The meeting continued but my mind already doubted this course of action. We continued for another twenty minutes or so when again we were interrupted by a member of staff who had to sign for a letter from HMRC for me. Immediately opened it and was stunned by its content, my 24 page letter of Complaint which had previously been rejected as valid reason of exceptional circumstances being unable to pay was now formally accepted, all defaults and penalties would be removed. £20,000 was immediately taken of the bill outstanding. Further until all of the pints I raised where reviewed and dealt with no further action will be taken by HMRC in relation to these debts. I let the blood sucker finish his pitch and the second he left informed all that we would continue and hope we would eventually get through this.
Never give up trying but know when to quit too. In my heart then and now I know I have no choice but to save my business, for my wife, for the employees and most of all for me, I have invested everything I have and I am to not go down to the last penny. Who is going to employee a PWP, heart bypass person in today’s world? Unlike Jilly Cooper (why I got so pissed off by that article) I cannot afford to spend every lunch time at the pub and moan that the local authorities could not do more. In many ways I am still in the trap and still have huge problems with HMRC waiting to be resolved
If you have read this far then I guess another page will not hurt, below is a copy of the letter to the PM. I have removed info where legally necessary.
Thank you to those who prayed for us, please do so again and to the kind and supportive words of others.
The Rt Hon David Cameron MP
10 Downing Street
London SW1A 2AA
Dear Mr Cameron,
Can I please ask your assistance in a serious problem my business XXXX Ltd is having with HMRC. We are the victims of theft by our accountancy firm who stole £223,000 from us over two years. This money was to cover VAT payment for which they were engaged to do as well as manager our accounts. We entrusted this Company who were highly recommended to look after my business as at the time I was recovering from a heart bypass operation. My on-going health has got worse with Parkinson’s disease so it has been critical the part they played in my Company.
It now transpires they were not paying the VAT and not a single penny was paid. An employee of our accountants has handed them self in to the police and admitted the crime. That is being progressed at a snail’s pace,
We struck a deal with HMRC to pay a monthly amount and give them money as we got it back through the police case. The debt to HMRC is £97,000, HMRC hold TSATM liable even though they accept we are the victims of serious fraud. HMRC failed to discover that the payments had been made and it took them two years to realise they were also duped by this individual.
We failed to pay our last quarter payment on time by 3 days, the payment to cover the debt was made on time. HMRC have decided because we were 3 days late that the agreement was now void and have served us with 7 days’ notice to pay the full amount or they will take over and sell our goods and close us down.
This is lunacy, 15 people jobs will vanish, these poor people will be a burden to the state costing more than this £97,000. We are a good business, bring back manufacturing to the UK, every penny of profit back in to the business. We contribute not burden the Country.
My Wife and I have given everything to this business, our savings, our home and our health, we are caught in a crazy situation as victims being bullied by our state. We have nothing more to give, please help us and bring some sanity to this matter. Please inform your HMRC people to support us, help us, and work with us in this exceptional circumstances issue, so that we can continue to contribute to our Country.
We are trying to get our Bank to help but it looks very doubtful, it is extremely difficult if not impossible to borrow money to pay off a debt.
My business is based in xxxxxx, its employees mostly live in xxxxxx.
We have very little time and without your intervention all will be lost in the next 7 days.
Please I know you are under many pressures please make time for us in any way you can.