There’s hole in the bucket

About Parkinson's and health Treatments and therapies
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For International Women’s Day here is a song in solidarity with all those who would like to see the NHS behave responsibly in relation to drug-induced harms.

There’s hole in the bucket Harry Belafonte and Falumi

There’s a hole in the bucket, dear Liza, dear Liza,
There’s a hole in the bucket, dear Liza, a hole.

    Then mend it, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    Then mend it, dear Henry, dear Henry, mend it.

With what shall I mend it, dear Liza, dear Liza?
With what shall I mend it, dear Liza, with what?

    With straw, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    With straw, dear Henry, dear Henry, with straw.

The straw is too long, dear Liza, dear Liza,
The straw is too long, dear Liza, too long.

    Then cut it, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    Then cut it, dear Henry, dear Henry, cut it.

With what shall I cut it, dear Liza, dear Liza?
With what shall I cut it, dear Liza, with what?

    With a knife, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    With a knife, dear Henry, dear Henry, a knife.

The knife is too dull, dear Liza, dear Liza,
The knife is too dull, dear Liza, too dull.

    Then sharpen it, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    Then sharpen it, dear Henry, dear Henry, sharpen it.

With what shall I sharpen it, dear Liza, dear Liza?
With what shall I sharpen it, dear Liza, with what?

    With a stone, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    With a stone, dear Henry, dear Henry, a stone.

The stone is too dry, dear Liza, dear Liza,
The stone is too dry, dear Liza, too dry.

    Then wet it, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    Then wet it, dear Henry, dear Henry, wet it.

With what shall I wet it, dear Liza, dear Liza?
With what shall I wet it, dear Liza, with what?

    With water, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    With water, dear Henry, dear Henry, with water.

In what shall I fetch it, dear Liza, dear Liza?
In what shall I fetch it, dear Liza, in what?

    In a bucket, dear Henry, dear Henry, dear Henry,
    In a bucket, dear Henry, dear Henry, in a bucket.

But there’s a hole in my bucket, dear Liza, dear Liza,
There’s a hole in my bucket, dear Liza, a hole.

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Hi. Can you explain some more about this? I don’t know what you mean by ‘drug induced’ harms, or what the relevance is of the song, or International Women’s Day, or what you want the NHS to do. In fact, I am mystified.

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Hi. Apologies for the lack of clarity. I find music and a bit of humour very soothing. The woman wants a job done. The man has plenty of energy for excuses but the job does not get done and we are left with the possibility of the excuses becoming an endless loop.
Metaphorically speaking the NHS is the bucket and patient safety is the hole. And I happen to be a woman mightily tired of excuses.
My specific situation is about recognition of drug-induced movement disorders but internationally I imagine reluctance of health services to apologise and improve so that adverse events do not reoccur would be fairly common.
https://davidhealy.org/a-call-to-harms/

A Call to H*ARMS David Healy November, 20, 2017

Treatment induced drug wrecks are the leading cause of death and disability on the planet. Studies suggest treatment accounts for up to a third of deaths in hospital settings, where deaths may be caused by chemotherapy or the cardiac effects of drugs but will be put down to cardiovascular causes or cancer. The drug induced death rate can only be greater in community settings where most deaths occur and where people are less likely to have conditions that can be blamed as the cause.

… The hiding of harms has contributed to a growing medical nastiness, when we raise them. Faced with adverse events, some doctors get very nasty. Sensing this, and having no way to know who will and who won’t get nasty, we become increasingly nervous to mention adverse events.

https://davidhealy.org/even-docs-get-killed-by-akathisia/

Even Docs get killed by Akathisia September, 11, 2018

Response to above article Julie Greene says: March 20, 2019

To err is human, but apology has gone out the window, apparently. I have known doctors and nondoctors alike who seem afraid to apologize and will avoid this at all costs. Doctors can avoid malpractice lawsuits if they apologize sincerely to the patients (or families) that they harmed.
Most people have been harmed by a doctor at least one time. Often, the results of this harm are temporary or inconsequential. Sometimes, a doctor’s action, or failure to act, results in deep harm. The patient is left bewildered and confused when the doctor, instead or reaching out and apologizing, instead, kicks the patient out of his practice, does not communicate, refuses any future medical care, badmouths the patient, and even retaliates, in attempt to discredit the patient by diagnosis, drugging, or psychiatric imprisonment.
This is the wrong way to go. It doesn’t avoid a lawsuit. Instead, patients get angry and take to social media because they have nowhere else to vent their frustration. Those that can afford an attorney might sue.
I really believe doctors are human. If they have erred, they need to communicate with the patient and apologize. They also need to make a sincere effort not to repeat the same mistake with other patients. If they are not capable of apology, if they’re incapable of admitting mistakes and learning from them, then they should not be doctors.

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Thank you for the explanation.

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The harm caused by Big Pharma is horrific.
At least 50% of men over 50 will suffer catastrophic impulse control disorders if on a therapeutic dose of DAs.
The research from such as the Mayo Clinic has been in the public domain for 10 years…many lives still being ruined,
No legal action taken in the U.K. although successful class action eps in the USA and court action in France and Australia.
Still victims’ relatives stumble into the Forum with wrecked relationships, finances gone due to hypersexual behaviour and gambling.
Still some Neurologists deny the drugs are to blame.
Still there is no or little help for those families in torment and despair.
Many of us now face the advanced Parkinsons torment of hallucinations and psychosis caused by Levadopa and the handwringing response from neuros who feel it is a worthwhile trade-off for better mobility.
All helping support the vast profits of Big Pharma.
We coped with the Parkinson’s.
The treatment has ruined our lives.

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It isn’t clear to me what you think the alternative is. Some of the drugs we are prescribed can have serious side effects. This isn’t the medical profession’s fault. If there were drugs, effective against the symptoms of PD that did not have side effects, then I’m sure that doctors would prescribe them.

When a patient is prescribed a drug, she should be warned about the possibility of side effects, so that she can make an informed choice. But we can also inform ourselves by obtaining information from sites like this and asking questions.

What is your alternative to Levodopa?

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Hi Jane,
Sorry if my post seems alarmist!
I support many families who have suffered as we have suffered with drug-induced nightmare lives.
I personally would ban DAs as I think the side effects are too horrific.
If 50% of patients went blind on a drug it might be withdrawn.
As that isn’t going to happen…I would advise anyone on them to research all the side effects and learn all about ICDs.
I would add…take a friend or relative to appointments with you and urge them to be honest about any odd behaviour they have witnessed…show them your internet history…and let them report if it is being erased…
For advanced Parkinsons patients on Levadopa…make sure they have regular mental health assessments.
All reports of psychotic episodes, hallucination, paranoia should trigger a meeting of professionals to consider reducing the dose.
The big problem that I see with Parkinson’s treatment that I see is neuros judging everything on how well mobility is being managed.
The mental health problems are the worst to deal with for many but are dismissed too often by professionals as a tradeoff that is worth good mobility.
In my, and others’ experience, it is not…and lives are ruined.

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I don’t know what you mean by a ‘DA’ or an ‘ICD’. These are not acronyms that I’ve come across before despite reading this site and other Parkinson’s advice sites regularly.

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DA is dopamine agonist
ICD is impulse control disorder

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OK. I’m not taking an agonist, but I have been offered one on a couple of occasions. All the professionals advising me, neurologists, PD nurse, my GP and the PUK advice line have advised me on the risks of OCD behaviour as a side effect. It’s been left up to me whether I want to take that risk. Up until now, in fact, I’ve opted not to use an agonist and one reason for that is the risk of compulsive behaviour. I deal with our household finances, and if I did start on an agonist, I’d want my husband to monitor my spending carefully.

But I don’t have any sense of medics brushing the risks under the table, or underestimating them, and I don’t think it is very useful to direct anger against the medical profession for failing to come up with perfect drugs.

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The term ICDs has taken over from OCDs…impulse control disorders rather than obsessive compulsive disorders.
They mean obsessive behaviour mainly gambling or hypersexuality but also punding, eating shopping…a whole variety of destructive behaviours which have led to marriage breakdowns, bankruptcy, police involvement.
There is a whole topic under impulsive behaviour on this forum…going back years, documenting some dreadful ruined lives.
Some neuros are well aware of the risks and warn patientsand familiesand monitor patients.Sadly some don’t and people stumble into the forum in torment at what is happening to a loved family member.
As long as you have a good, knowledgable neuro you will be fine…and Dopamine Agonists are far more likely to cause these effects than Sinemet.
Read, learn and stay safe…you will be fine.
Best wishes
GG